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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 10th, 2012, 5:40 am 
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I have to agree with the others on this though. It was exactly my first thought when I read that post.

I also have to agree the range of basses available to us lefties at this moment is huge! Sure, it can be a pain in the ass if you're looking for something very specific. But thanks to the internet, you can find a wealth of left handed basses from around the world with just a few clicks and have them shipped to your front door. I bought most of my instruments used on the internet and I couldn't be happier with what I've got. Sure, there's always some GAS lurking somewhere within, but they're just a luxury. I could get on perfectly fine if I was forced to keep only one, but I choose not to. And yes, it bums me when I walk into a guitar store and the only lefty they have (if any at all) is a Squier Precision Special in black with a white pickguard. Which is a great instrument for the money, but absolutely not what I'm looking for. But then I visit this site, or eBay, or Arni's site at any given moment, and there's always something that has me go "GOD, IF ONLY I HAD THE MONEY RIGHT NOW!"

It's not that bad being a lefty :)

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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 10th, 2012, 9:17 am 
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Matt R. wrote:
"Not giving a shit" and comparing the availability of left handed instruments to racial and gender bigotry are in completely different universes. Someone who has experienced the brunt of racism or gender discrimination would laugh in your face about getting so worked up over what, in the end, is an economic/marketing decision by an instrument manufacturer.
I wish there were more choices, but I have a bad ass arsenal of basses. So yeah, I'm not gonna get all militant because Gibson won't make me a lefty Ripper. Fuck them.


I agree, on the surface it might seem a bit extreme to be comparing the adversities that lefties today have to contend with vs. racism, sexism, etc., but what if we were having this conversation hundreds of years ago? (Via our quills and messenger pigeons, LOL). Lefty = sinister. If you read up on the history of left handedness, you learn that lefties were considered evil at one time and were amputated, burned at the stake (they loved to use that as a common solution to many problems, didn't they?), etc. So you could argue that the level of discrimination was on par with racism today once upon a time.

As for Gibson - f*ck 'em! Do you really want to line the pockets of a company that doesn't respect you enough to release a SINGLE left handed bass over the past 35 years anyway?! So what exactly are we lamenting here, the inability to wear a name brand? Build your own Ripper, or buy a Gaskell lefty knockoff - and wear it with pride. :)

I've been collecting lefty basses for over 15 years now. It's not easy, and in some cases has taken those 15 years to find certain instruments, but I'd like to believe a lefty collection is that much more rewarding to acquire vs. some righty who could walk into any store in the world and buy up dozens of instruments immediately because they're far more easily accessible. So long story short: there ARE many lefty choices out there, old and new, though trying one first hand is usually the biggest dilemma. I think the internet, ebay, classifieds, etc. has made it extremely easy to find lefties today. When I bought my '72 J back in 1984, NONE of this technology existed yet, so a search consisted of daily pilgrimages for over a year to 48th st. in NYC, searching newspaper classifieds, etc.

And when all is said and done, how many instruments do you REALLY need to play music? Unless you are a collector, I'd say anywhere from 1 to 4 instruments? If I stopped collecting (which I more or less have; moving on to acoustic guitars now. ;) ) and had to live with 1 bass,I could do it with a Squire Jazz and be content with the joy of creating music.

Here's 5 reasons you're better off being righty anyway:

http://www.cracked.com/article_19808_5- ... -life.html


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 10th, 2012, 11:47 am 
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mcarp555 wrote:
Addison: I'm sorry you misunderstood or misread my original comments. But I don't feel that blasting me was an appropriate response. Maybe next time if you're confused about something, ask for clarification. A lot of this nonsense could have been avoided.

I didn't misunderstand anything.

You made a direct comparison between you not being able to buy the bass you want and the very serious subject of racial and sexual discrimination.

I didn't "blast" you... I just said that the comparison between the two was ridiculous at any level and I wasn't the only person who felt that way. I'm guessing that if you told your personal story of lefty discrimination to a Holocaust survivor or someone whose grandparents were bought and sold as slaves, my reaction would be pretty mild in comparison.

In fact, if I recall correctly, you took the same approach with your letter to Hofner, and they were offended by your comments as well. Rightly so, in my opinion.

Anyway, I hope you understand that anything you say on a message board is there for the whole internet world to see and is up for debate by anyone who disagrees with it... it's nothing personal.

Bygones.

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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 10th, 2012, 12:04 pm 
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Luckily your opinion is irrelevant, so I'm not as bothered as I was by the unfortunate way you chose to express your disagreeing with me. As you said, online you have to deal with all levels of people. So I won't let your comments change what I think in any way.

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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 11th, 2012, 4:02 am 
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Location: Victoria Australia
This may bring some prospective to this post. Here in Australia a youth support group are running an ad on TV using left handness as an argument against other discrimations " Gays and Bullies".

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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 11th, 2012, 9:24 pm 
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Addison wrote:
mcarp555 wrote:
Fifty years ago, black people were required to ride on the back of the bus, drink from segregated water fountains, and sit in "colored" sections of restaurants (if they even served 'negros').

Women were expected to not work, and if they did, to earn less then men. A woman in a position of authority, such as a judge or a member of Congress was considered a ludicrous idea.

I'm not going to get into a debate over this... but i have to tell you that the comparison between lefties not having many basses to choose from and the oppression that women and people of color have suffered through the last... I dunno... THOUSANDS of years... is completely fucking absurd.

I'm just as pissed as the next guy about our lack of choices... but it's a bass... it's a luxury I get to enjoy because I can afford it and I have the time. It's not my human rights. People aren't hanging me from trees, dousing me in acid, stoning me to death or burning me alive.

The fact that I can't just run out and buy something because I am part of a population that is less than 1% of the buying market has NOTHING to do with the level of discrimination that you mentioned in your post. The thought is utterly ridiculous.

Anyway... carry on.

:roll:


Thank you, Addison, for saying exactly what I've been wanting to say for a few months now.

I didn't want to get my shoes dirty by stepping in it. But sometimes it's gotta be done.

I agree with you 100%.


Last edited by bbl on November 11th, 2012, 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 11th, 2012, 9:26 pm 
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I can't get a stock Fender P-Bass in olympic white! :x

Call the ACLU! :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 12th, 2012, 6:55 am 
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Looking at the original question of "Should Left Handed students learn to play RH" I think is just wrong, there is no science behind my statement but I feel that if your left handed like us, if you force a kid to learn right handed you are teaching them to confirm and at the first lesson you are teaching them to loose their creativity. I was faced with this issue last year, my daughter is a skilled piano player, she is getting into her teenage years and asked if I could show her how to play bass. Some of her friends already play guitar and piano and she wanted to play bass (besides her piano is more classical/jazz and her friends want to play pop/rock).

For me the answer was easy, with a bunch of LH basses in the basement why buy a RH bass, but from an artistic point of view I want her to be own person and I feel that she will be a better player by playing what comes natural.

Footnote: She is a national honor student who won the presidential academic excellence award for writing but she holds her pencil with the most unusual grip:) It used to drive me nuts how she held her pencil like a caveman but once she taught me: it does not matter how you hold your instrument it's what you do with it that counts.

Lastly, For guitar shows I often look at the vendors who are going (they are normally the same follks) and if they have a nice lefty posted on line, I usually email them and ask them to bring it to the show and they are always happy to do so.


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 12th, 2012, 8:48 am 
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I would like to add to this thread if I may. I must first state that I am right handed in almost everything accept playing a guitar or bass. I consider myself a part of this forum as I play left-handed instrument and that this is all for the most part, that I own.

When I first started to play, I did try to learn right-handed. I struggled for a very long time, just think trying to text on a Blackberry using your two large toes! I had no dexterity in my left-hand, and as much as I tried, I could not get it to work as I wanted. The break through came when one day I looked at my wall and saw a poster of Jimi Hendrix to whom I thought was God at the time (youth). I figured, what the hell have I got to lose!

When in a week of flipping the Kay bass that I owned, I was playing along to records.....remember those?! This was all back in 1979, and I am proud to be a left-handed bass player to this day.

I would recommend that when teaching students, explain to them the pros and cons of playing left or right-handed. Let them decide which they would like to play and what feels comfortable. From that point on encourage and support their decision. Taking away their choice will likely turn learning an instrument into work. If they feel as if someone they look up to, would not support their discussion, it may end up being the final nail in the coffin. Keep it fun!

Hope this helps!



Bill


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 12th, 2012, 9:24 am 
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Very well said

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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 13th, 2012, 11:03 am 
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In my opinion, the "issues" I might associate with playing lefty instruments aren't significant enough to persuade me to play right handed instruments. It's not even close.

I also think the issues one might perceive are overstated. Quality lefty instruments are not "rare," in my opinion. They're not difficult to find. I certainly haven't had a problem. And left handed instruments seem to be more accessible than ever.

I can perhaps recall a couple of instances when someone had a righty guitar at a party, and I had wished I had brought my lefty to play. I deal with that now by bringing a cheapy guitar with me.

I believe that, if I were an instructor, I'd want my students to be as comfortable as possible. I wouldn't want any discomfort to impede the learning process.


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 13th, 2012, 11:09 am 
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I agree with bbl but I must add that yes quality left handed instruments are not hard to find in the US. I think it is a little more sporty in other countries. Internet and forums such as this one have changed everything for us. What a nightmare it used to be before!


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: November 13th, 2012, 1:34 pm 
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Location: Pittsburgh, PA
bbl wrote:
In my opinion, the "issues" I might associate with playing lefty instruments aren't significant enough to persuade me to play right handed instruments. It's not even close. <<<< FOR SURE!!!

I also think the issues one might perceive are overstated. Quality lefty instruments are not "rare," in my opinion. They're not difficult to find. I certainly haven't had a problem. And left handed instruments seem to be more accessible than ever. <<<< NO DOUBT

I can perhaps recall a couple of instances when someone had a righty guitar at a party, and I had wished I had brought my lefty to play. I deal with that now by bringing a cheapy guitar with me. <<<< I JUST GRAB THEIR RIGHTY, FLIP IT OVER AND JAM ON IT INVERTED STRINGS :lol:

.
:roll:

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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: December 3rd, 2012, 6:43 am 
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Wow – That certainly caused a few ripples!
I'm 42, and was schooled in a coalmining community in County Durham, NE England. Not the most progressive of upbringing. There was no overt 'ism' about being a lefty other than a bit of mild teasing ('cuddy-handed' is what my Dad called it). However I know my pen-manship was considered atrocious because I smudged everything despite being amongst the highest in the class academically. My Grandmother had had her left arm strapped behind her back at school so I'm lucky to have missed that piece of barbarism.
In 4th grade the class was given a 'music aptitude' subsequently and I was given one of 4 brand new full size cellos to learn on. It was bigger than me; but I was pleased to give it a go. In hindsight I know that this was a catastrophe as I was forced to start with my left hand on the fingerboard. If only I had I discovered the Beatles earlier, I would have seen their bassist was a lefty and maybe started on bass rather than guitar after the cello. I've played guitar RH now for 30 years and bass LH for 3. I suspect that I'd be a much better player if I'd started out lefty. So who do you blame?
The teacher for making me play cello RH? My parents for not making a fuss or sticking up for me? Manufacturers for not making enough LH instruments? Or myself for not realising until recently that as a lefty person I should be playing lefty!
Maybe Society for not recognising the hidden costs of this particularly invisible 'ism'. Leftys die younger, we're more prone to mental illness, there is a higher incidence of dyslexia amongst LH and we're 6 times more likely to visit a hospital. Mostly through trying to function in a world that's upside down and back to front. The least we can ask for is the same rights as our longer living Dextrous friends.
I say we need to speak up. It's not a trivial matter. It's life changing. From the Underground barriers where the ticket readers are on the wrong side to bank counter pens, RH desks in study halls; everywhere we are silently discriminated against.
Statistics show that 10% of people are LH, that's twice the population of the USA! It's time they were catered for.
Now a guitar teacher myself, the first thing I ask a new student is if they're LH or RH. Some will swear they're RH but quite clearly they're uncomfortable with RH guitar. A dead giveaway is when they continually get a 'G major' chord the wrong way round. At this point I hand them a lefty and they go 'Ahhh! - that's better!' -
There could be up to 700 million people living the wrong way round. I'd like them to be able to say 'Ah! That's better!'


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: February 8th, 2013, 12:09 am 
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I remember being pissed off the first time I went into a music store looking for a lefty guitar. I was 18. The guy didn't sell any left handed models but gave me the hard sell on switching to right-handed instead. I was irritated because i knew he was trying to make a sale and didn't care about what was in my best interest.

Playing lefty felt more natural and comfortable. It's already challenging enough to teach yourself to play....why make it harder?


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: February 8th, 2013, 12:47 pm 
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Location: Upstate NY
<1%????????????????????????? Says who?


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: February 8th, 2013, 12:49 pm 
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andymunro73 wrote:
My Grandmother had had her left arm strapped behind her back at school so I'm lucky to have missed that piece of barbarism.


So did I! Until my Mom came storming in and told the nuns to knock it off. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: February 8th, 2013, 1:22 pm 
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mcarp555 wrote:
Luckily your opinion is irrelevant


Rude much?


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: February 16th, 2013, 8:16 pm 
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Everything stated here is a huge part in why I got into building . Help make the world a better place for the lefty , one instrument at a time .
You can't reason with a closed mind , so why bother ? Just ignore it and put it behind you .
We are all wired differently . I know of 2 right handed people that play left handed .


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 Post subject: Re: why bother with leftys?
PostPosted: February 17th, 2013, 9:33 am 
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Otterhound, now you know 3. :D

To the OP, it would be interesting to experiment with your students as to which way is easier for them to learn; You demonstrating with a right handed or left handed instrument.

It has always seemed easy for me when looking at someones fingering on a right handed guitar to recognize the finger/fret positions instantly because, as you pointed out, it is like looking in a mirror.

Inquiring minds want to know. :geek:

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