LeftyBassist.com

POSTED IN TB--Would love your thoughts

So, I am in a bit of a dilemma. I just bought this weekend a TH-350 with a Aguilar DB 112. I absolutely loved the tone, however, it was not enough volume even fully cranked for a relatively loudish church gig (it was fine for my smaller church gig). We had a touring bassist come in to lead our worship night (2 hour set) and he said I definitely needed more power since he could not hear me. (We tried all sorts of EQ). My wife, who is our lead singer, could not hear either. At this church we play on a large stage, and put everything into the PA system. Amp is a stage monitor. I am playing my 2005 Jazz Deluxe with SCN Noiseless pickups.

I am going to get the TH-500 for sure to put some more power into the mix. That is a non-negotiable.

However, I am wondering if I need a bigger cab. As much as I love the idea of a DB 115, I do not like the idea of traveling with it since I am playing at 3 different places, one with a going up stairs load in.

I play mainly contemporary christian, and some occasional bar gigs featuring Pop and classic rock. I play about 75% fingers, 15% pick, 10% slap, but don't need glassy highs.

So three questions:
1. How does the Bergantino NV 115 match up tonally with the Aguilar DB- 112?

2. Can people carry their Berg with one hand easily? (I'm a big guy myself).

3. Will I notice a huge volume increase using both the Berg and the TH-500, even though I am not powering the Berg all the way up to its 500 watt capacity.

I need to make a decision by tomorrow for reasons I don't want to get into.

Thanks TB

the NV is 53 lbs, I doubt it's a one hand carry. I know for sure I'd put it on a cart or have someone help me with any schlepp more than 30 feet.

From what I understand, with the NV15 being a sealed cab, you're going to need those extra watts to make the cab live up to its potential.

Can't give you a tonal comparison, I've never used either cab.

But I will say if it were me, I'd def lean towards the NV15 simply for its old school tonal profile. either it or a Bear ML115 wil likely be my next cab purchase (after my fEERLESS F210 gets done being built).

Don't mean to divert the thread but how is 350 watts not enough for a church stage? I'm asking out of total ignorance of the TH350 and your specific church setting so I'm just honing in on the 350 watts part. Where I am my everyday amp puts out 8 watts yet works good for me volume-wise thru a 4x10 so when I hear a number like 350 or 500 watts not cutting it, it raises my eyebrow.

I know there's tons of variables here like the room size, number of inputs, mixer, PA, etc. but can't help but wonder if it would help to look at exactly how everything is setup on stage and mixed. And, even in church, I don't mean to imply that 8 watts should work for your situation either.

I also recall that there's not as much difference (in actual sound, loudness, decibels) between say a 50 watter vs. 100 watter (a double in watts) as one would think. In other words, it's not twice as loud but only like 3 more decibels or something. So I wouldn't expect 500 vs. 350 to solve your problem which may lie elsewhere.

KOAmps: The TH350 puts out about 170 or so watts at 8 ohms. I believe his current cab is 8 ohms.

And I just looked over at aggie and it says the TH500 is 250 watts at 8ohms. I don't know. Maybe that route will work for him. Maybe that's just enough more decibels to make the difference.

But just so I'm clear should I understand his bass is running direct to the board and the soundguy has him the way it's gonna be in FOH? And he's OK with that part. That out in the audience (congregation) is fine. But up on stage in monitor world no one can hear him with 135 watts in a church?

That is starting to look like garage band loud-wars 101.

velalv, as soon as you spend more money to double your watts and add a cab everyone else in the band simply will reach over to their amps and twist their knobs a little more to the right and you will be SOL all over again.

I think the Berg is not going to be louder than the Aguilar cab despite the larger speaker. A sealed cab will be less loud than a ported one.

I think your best bet is to get a 4 ohm cab if you only want one cab. Or a second Aguilar 112.

Maybe a pair of the Aguilar SL112s? They're only 25 lbs. each, so moving two isn't that tough.

I choose Bergantino for tone, but there's no point having sweet tone no one can hear.

All, thank you for engaging with me on this issue.

Ok, so to bring you up to date, for the reasons that Andrew stated I have decided against an NV 115. I only have enough coin for a Cab or amp, not both. At this point, I am leaning toward getting a SL 112 and trading in the DB 112. The SL112 has a sensitivity of 99 1W 1M while the DB was at 95.

For King of Amps, I have three churches I play at. At two of them the DB 112 is enough volume with the TH 350 cranked pretty high,and -10db pad off, as it puts 170 watts into 8 ohms, and the DB is not the most sensitive cab in the world. At the other place I play, we have a large stage and a santuary that seats about 700. The bass would go into the front of the house, however the amp has to be enough monitor for the whole stage, my wife included because the leaders there did not want to feed any bass signal into the wedges. The second the keyboard player came in I was absolutely buried.

The church is an old converted industrial workhouse, so it could almost pass for a garage club if it wasn't for the crosses all over the place and pictures of poor people around reminding us of our obligations to those with less than myself. The acoustics are a little weird with the hollow stage and high ceiling. Hope that helps!

You're in a tough spot.

They're basically saying hey velalv we don't want you in the monitors like everyone else who we can hear just fine but we need you to work some magic some other way so we can hear you somehow.

I'm having a Revelations-style vision velalv of you jumping thru all these hoops and getting more cabs and more power and filling that stage with just the right amount of bass and then right at your moment of glory........the keyboardist (with fire in his eyes ) asks you to turn it down (a little).

Will you turn the knob and the other cheek?

Nice! Anyhow, just to close the loop on this I decided to get a TH 500 and a Berg CN 112. I will be getting a second Berg CN 112 in the next couple of months. I really wanted something that I could carry around, and the DB 112 was not that cabinet. Loved the tone, but didn't want to have to schlep it all the time. And to King of Amps, yes, I would turn down, and then leave and never come back
In this case though the keyboardist won't be coming back as he is an itinerant musician.

I play in a kick ass rock band that probably plays louder than your church and the Ampeg BA-115 has never let me down as a stage monitor with a direct into PA. I'd suggest kicking your soundguy in the pants.

I realized that I did not post my rig. Here is my new rig with my two basses. The one on the left will be for sale in the coming months. I got to play this rig the other night at the huge church space. This time my wife was the bandleader, and she likes a quieter stage. She never, ever commented on the tone of my rig or bass until this Saturday night. She absolutely loved the tone and we had adequate volume when we were not maxing out the on stage monitors.

I'll still get a second Berg for bigger shows but for now I am good with what I got. Next stop on the GAS train will be a 5 string bass.