LeftyBassist.com

Hi there,

I know that some of you know about this bass. Actually it is here that I learned that bass was alive and available lefty. Thanks.

For those who have questions about the bass, I'll try to give them as much answers as I can. I'm not a techno-wiz, so there is some stuff about MIDI protocole that I don't know much but I'll do my best to give some answers.

Congrats again, slybass. So I take it you've got the midi module and power input plug for it now?

I had posted a couple of questions a while ago, so here they are4 along with a few others:

1. It is fully polyphonic, correct? The youtube videos don't really exhibit much of this.
2. Can multiple sounds be split across your fretboard/strings at once? So, for example, all notes below the 7th fret are set to a piano patch and all above are a violin patch? Or, each string is assigned a different sound and/or multiple sounds can be assigned to each fret and can be triggered according to your attack/velocity? (i.e. Play soft: piano sound, play hard: sax, for example). Could all sounds be assigned to 1 midi channel or does it require 4 separate channels, and could it be fully polyphonic for each sound in all instances (Axon units do not give you this).
3. If I'm reading the website correctly, the bass offers up to 36 storeable performance patches? But what if I needed to go beyond that? You mentioned you were looking to change patches with a foot controller, and the midi module does have a midi in for this purpose,
4. Since you had prior experience with the Peavey Cyberbase, how's the new bass compare/improve?
5. Overall bass weight?
6. How does string choice effect performance, and any noticeable performance deterioration as strings get older/duller? Will it work with flats, tapewounds, or Elixirs? (Obviously, you may not be able to answer this one for a while).
7. Any librarian or editor software now or in development? PC and Mac? Would love to store and backup performance patches on a computer and load them back in as needed. At the very least, the programming aspects of the Midi bass might be easier to do via a computer than on-board by scrolling through parameters via the A,D, and G strings and the 12 frets.
8. Reading about open strings/notes, it states that the system relies solely on the piezos to trigger note info whereas fretted notes have the benefit of both the piezo bridge and frets to recognize pitch. Does this mean the the latency on the open notes is slower than the rest of the fretboard?

That's all I can think of for now.

Hi PJ

here is a little upright sound's demo I sent to musical director whom bugs me recently to get an upright.

It is not perfect yet as far as sound but I'm getting really close.
Gee I can't send audio file in here.

What can i do ?

For PJ

1) Yes it is polyphonic. It is more difficult to play but very possible. I made a great patch with a fretless and it is really fun.

2) Polyphonic does require different midi channels so you program your patches accordingly. I haven't done too much experiment with it but for straight 4 channels it did work. I don't think you can split the fingerboard range in two. But you can limit the tracking range from bottom to top if desired. Depending on the modules you use you can assigned velocity to different sounds on the same channel if you want. I haven't done it yet with this one but it won't be a problem.

I'll get back to you soon for more.

I bought the FCB 1010 from Behr but it is still sealed in the box. LOL

Wow PJ, that's a bunch of great questions! I'm looking forward to the answers too.

Congrats again Sly. I suppose one question I have is do you think it's worth the money they are asking for it? I'm debating whether I want to get another F Bass BNF5 or spend MORE money and go for this thing which is only a 4 string.

Hi Mark, how is it going?

It is expensive but the bass itself is really good. Now with the new model which I think is may be not available for lefty...yet is really worth it for that new price. Even the big model to me is worth it.

Ok PJ a little part II,

I've received tonight a message from my friend Newcombe whose really involve in the developpement of the bass and he did mention that the original patch system will be back. Been able to change patches from dedicated notes on the bass,not just the G string which is good news.

Every update or memory can be back-up with sysex.

As far as strings, the bass came with roundwound and it sounds fine and the tracking is good. But the bass by itself sounds so good for slap that I think I'll try flats or something like that to prevent frets damage since the whole system is based on them. I'll experiment with it. I used to play with Maxima Gold on the old system for a good tracking but it doesn't seem a problem here with all the adjustments possible.

The weight is perfect just like on a regular 4 strings to me.

I don't think a librarian is available but after a little while I got use to know where most parameters are located on the bass.

I'll see if I have time to make some clips for the net with a good sound. It just might take some work to achieve it.

Later,

Sly

Thanks for the update, Sly.

Yes, fret wear is a concern of mine over time in addition to the tracking performance results of using different strings, which is one of the main reasons I've used Elixirs almost exclusively the past few years, since I'm lazy, cheap, and want maximum longevity along with punch and brightness without wearing down my frets. For a Jazz bass such as this, I think switching to flats would be giving up a lot of the tonal versatility of the bass's natural magnetic PUP sounds anyway.

I'm still planning on shooting Industrial Radio a lengthy e-mail about some fo my questions anyway, so I'll post what they say.

Hi Sly and PJ,

I'm addressing you both as you both seem to be eminently interested and or involved in this discussion. I would like to present, for your viewing and listening pleasure (assuming you haven't seen it before) Alain Caron playing Ink Illusion with his band and utilizing his F Bass AC 6 fretless with a 13 pin plug taking a feed off his piezo equipped bridge and I believe (please correct me if I'm wrong) going into a Roland V Bass system. Not sure if it's a VB99 or not.

It appears that the estimable Mr. Caron is VERY capable (as evidenced here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITQd2NtbOKA ) of achieving quite musical results with his setup.

Not being one to throw the proverbial monkey wrench into the discussion of the Industrial Radio MIDI Bass, but, and just for the sake of thinking what the ultimate synth bass guitar might be, what do you guys think about the F Bass/V Bass combo?

Just so you know where I stand, I'm leaning heavily towards the exceedingly cool aspect of having one of the best (if not THE best) fretless basses on the planet, which stands on its own phenomenally well without the synth side (not to say that's not the case with the bass we're talking about in this thread) and not having to worry about fret wear down the road. Just a fingerboard re-surfacing like a regular fretless.

Granted, it's about $1000 more for an AC5 than it is for the Industrial Radio bass, plus I don't know what the MIDI/13 pin option costs, plus the Roland VB99 at about $1300, but hey, it's only money right? What's $7000 or so in these tough economic times?

Food for thought? Or at least opinions? Sly, you probably know Alain, don't you? Isn't he from your part of the country? I've seen him play live several times over the years. From Uzeb in Vancouver in the mid 80's to Roland seminars, etc., etc. He's definitely one of my heroes. Always creative, always stretching the boundaries. He's been dabbling in synth bass guitar for decades now.

Here are 2 pics that I grabbed off the F Bass web site of an AC6 showing the 13 pin plug. This may actually be one of Alain Caron's basses.

This is a righty bass but I flipped the images. Looks cooler don't you think?

Cool bass. Love the bridge design, hate the Orange color!

I think the photo is giving it more orange hue than it may have in a real life. I think it's supposed to be like an average violin or standup bass in color. Anyway, sorry guys, I hope we're not diverging too much from the topic of this thread. It's supposed to be about the Industrial Radio MIDI bass.

I have been a midi bassist/13 pin Roland user for a couple of years now and spent a LOT of time researching this subject. Here's what you need to know as the prime reasons why the Industrial Midi Bass is so appealing over the Roland or other pitch-to-midi devices:

The Radio Bass offers the lowest latency in existence across the FULL range of the bass, especially the lowest register, and regardless of what note you're playing. The Roland VB99 is not a midi device (though you can send midi out), as they work well with minimal latency as long as you're using the VB99 as your sound module. The VB99 does have some synth patches, but by and large it's an upscale effects unit with a handful of other COSM sounds. For most dabblers, this setup might be fine, but once you try to take advantage of the endless possibilities and flexibility of midi and start slaving outboard synths to it via midi out, you'll run inot major problems with latency. So bad, in fact, that you'll find playing any note below low A virtually intolerable. Pitch-to-midi devices cannot recognize lower frequencies quick enough to make them useful. There are a few workarounds to this kind of setup, however, one being what I've done with stringing my bass up with piccolo strings, but it will never be as flexible as the Radio Bass and there will always be a trade off. Furthermore, I'm not a 6 string player, which definitely helps expand your range and ability to control latency issues, since the vast majority of guys you see using pitch-to-midi setups effectively are almost exclusively keeping their synth patch control playing in the upper register to minimize latency (Including Alain Caron). You'll almost never see someone with a 13 pin setup controlling their midi patches playing notes below low A (unless it's some slow attack/velocity string swell, for example, that doesn't need to lock in tightly with the notes you're playing), and if you wanted to do something like a fast run in unison with your magnetic bass lines in the lower register (piano or marimba with a sharp attack/short sustain), you're out of luck. This is where a 6 string bass comes in handy, as you'll obviously have more upper range to control midi with less latency, but what if you want to play in your lower register and still control midi effectively? Can't really do it effectively.

So it's a trade off: outside of using the VB99 exclusively and using a 13 pin with other midi devices, you have to keep your playing in the upper register to minimize latency, but then you lose your ability to play lower bass range simultaneously should you want to blend in your magnetic PUP sound, since it would also be in the higher octave range. The only workarounds I could see working should you want to combine outboard midi gear with the VB99 and still retain lower bass register would be to call up a COSM bass patch from within the VB99 to replicate a real bass (there's a P, J, Stingray, and Rick in there) but detune it an octave lower when playing in the upper register, or run your magnetic PUP out to an octave pedal and detune it down (Which I've tried and guess what? It sounds just like a shitty octave pedal tuned down, though so far the Digitech Whammy does the most realistic "fake" bass sound I've found). Cost-wise, if you're willing to live with the limitations I outlined, keeping your playing in the upper register, you can get into a workable midi bass setup for under $750 and still make good use of the technology that pitch-to-midi offers with the workarounds I described by doing the following:

1. Buy a Douglas 6 string - $200
2. Roland GK3B PUP - $190
3. Used GR-20 - $350

You could even go cheaper with one of the older Roland GR units. I use the GR-33, which is a better/deeper unit than the GR-20, though it won't work with bass unless you string the bass up with piccolo strings.

Hey PJ,

Thanks for the thorough note there. Clearly you've spent some time mucking about with this. I'm actually fairly well read on a lot of these issues myself although I don't have the real world experience. I guess the thing that really piques my interest about the F Bass 13 pin setup is that I end up with an F Bass as the musical instrument that is part of the package. Not sure if you saw my BNF5 that I had for sale a while back but I'm trying to figure out a way to get another one (actually I've had 2 over the years). Love the F Bass!

Wat I may do is save up the dough and go for both, the F Bass fretless and the MIDI bass fretted. However, I was really hoping to have a fretted 5 string as part of my arsenal, not 4, and Industrial Radio isn't offering the 5 yet.

Guess I'll just have to wait.

No kidding, it's in his username

Sorry, just couldn't restrain myself.

LOL. Holy cow! I just realized that myself. Some sort of subconscious thing that "mucking about" would be the right term to use.

"Muck" is short for my last name (McCulloch), and was a nickname given to me in high school by my friends. So it has stuck with me...like "muck" on a shoe. Hey, what are friends for?

To add to the further hijacking of this thread, there's nothing wrong with a F Bass, so it's a win/win situation. Just be prepared to not be able to use the midi aspect of the instrument below a certain frequency, which, as I mentioned, starts getting bad below A.

other options I've considered to remedy this problem are a double necked guitar/bass combo with the midi PUP mounted to the guitar side, and an 8 string bass like this, which I'm thinking of picking up for this purpose:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Schecter-Stiletto-S ... 1e5b51ba2b

Looking at the design here, I believe a GK3B could be mounted back near the bridge and the string spacing of the octave strings is far enough apart from the bass strings back there that the GK's saddle sensors wouldn't get confused by the bass strings being nearby. This would now give you the option of playing either low bass note accompaniment simultaneously if you wanted that you could dial in and out of the mix or even mute on/off while a second cable runs out from your GK to your synth, PA, guitar amp,. etc. giving you separate control over each sound. You could even run the octave strings out to a guitar amp/separate effects unit and seemingly have a full band accompaniment to your bass register. Of course, you'd have to get used to playing an 8 string