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 Post subject: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 13th, 2010, 10:18 pm 
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Joined: March 9th, 2008, 7:46 am
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Location: West Orange, NJ
I came home this evening to find my sump pump died after failing to handle the amount of rain we've been having and a basement filled with 6" of water. Unfortunately, I keep my equipment down there, including all my basses! The basses were stored upright but water got into the bottom of the cases. I scrambled to get them out of there and wiped each of them down. So far, I don't see any permanent water damage to the finishes, but the cases are soaked. Likewise, about 4" from the bottom of my amp was submerged and other electronics, power strips, etc. (Midi foot controller was completely under water. Any immediate advice to make sure I can salvage as much as possible? ASAP please.

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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 13th, 2010, 10:33 pm 
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Joined: January 12th, 2009, 10:44 pm
Posts: 137
Location: Dunmore, PA
Man, I know how bad a flooded basement can be. You have my sympathy. Don't know if this will help. I saw an industrial drive house cleaned up with cans of air & contact cleaner. Good luck!!

Jim


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 14th, 2010, 12:22 am 
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OMG Peter, that horrible! I would get everything out of the basement and into drier air immediately. (No doubt you've done that already!)

Next thing to do would be to tear everything apart and either dry it with rags/towels or like Jim_k said to start blasting away with compressed air. Maybe rent a compressor tomorrow from your local Ace hardware.

Some of the sealed components like footswitches and pots will probably be better served by getting blasted with solvents that dissipate water. Tryclorothane (sorry don't know any brand names) comes to mind, but it is toxic, you should do that outdoors. Ask your local hardware guy for a deal on a bulk purchase of self-dissolving contact cleaner.

You'll probably need to open up all the cabs and let them air out. Hopefully they weren't getting soaked for too long so that the wood doesn't warp or get mouldy as it dries out.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 14th, 2010, 9:47 am 
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Joined: March 4th, 2008, 3:51 pm
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Location: Pacific Northwest
This really sucks, I'm very sorry to hear this Peter. I don't have any answers to help with this. You might want to talk to Kevin from Kebo's Bass Works, he has a lot of know-how on stuff like this.
www.kebosbassworks.com

Are all your basses OK?


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 14th, 2010, 2:44 pm 
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Joined: January 4th, 2009, 6:07 am
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Location: Jacksonville, Fl.
Get a dehumidifier going asap. Let it run for at least ten days. Some anti microbial spray to quell any potential mold growth.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 14th, 2010, 3:24 pm 
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PJ may be in a world of hurt. there are power outages all over the place in his neck of the woods.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 14th, 2010, 8:34 pm 
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Joined: November 26th, 2008, 6:14 am
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Open up your pedals and electronic devices and expose them to the air where there is circulation. that will at least dry out the water in the circuitry. Many times people who have had their cell phones for example get dunked have allowed them to dry for at lest two to four days, and the were able to power them up. It's essential of course to let your electronic devices dry completely before turning them on.

As said before, some kind of spray that expells water, but doesn't leave a residue behind would help also. so sorry to hear about your situation, and I hope nothing is permanently damaged. As a suggestion for the future, find enough shelves, palettes, etc., that will keep all of your equipment and instruments at least a foot or so off the floor, so that water damage will not be an issue again.

Good luck,
Ian

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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 14th, 2010, 11:48 pm 
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PJ, I don't know what to say, terrible terrible news, this totally sucks. I'm postponing any frivilous posting until we know your status. Let us know how you are doing, we are all concerned for you. Ditto on advice given thusfar (dehumidifier, open everything up, circulated air, don't turn anything on until you are certain it's dry, etc.) For the smaller stuff (boards, pedals, etc.) in the past I have had some luck with this- open them up, let a hair dryer on LOW heat blow thru them from a few feet away for a couple hours til dry, then let them just air out for a day or two.

This is everyone's nightmare who has equipment in their basement. My local group of buddies practices in my basement all the time so there's always drums and gear down there, but I just can't bring myself to keep guitars down there for this very reason.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 15th, 2010, 6:54 am 
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AGH!!!

Oh, man... I hope everything is OK!!!

As others have said... keep the cases open and run dehumidifiers. Since this is a bass forum, it's easy to be overly concerned about them on here... but, I hope all of your other stuff and your family is OK too.

Let us know what's up when you can...

:(

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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 15th, 2010, 8:50 am 
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Joined: March 9th, 2008, 7:46 am
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Location: West Orange, NJ
Hello, everyone. Many thanks for your help and concerns. It's much appreciated.

All told, I dodged a few bullets. The instruments appear to be fine, as I got them out of their cases ASAP wiped them all down, so there's no visible bubbling up in the finishes or wood. The water had reach the lowest portion of the basses, just below the bridges, I think. I've had no time to open every one of their control plates, compartments, etc. up to see if water got into the electronics, however. (That's the unfortunate result of owning too many instruments!). Too much other damage control I've had to deal with. The cases are all opened and airing out in the garage right now, since I had no other location to put them in. (Note to self: get a bigger house!). Today I'm running out to get a new de-humidifier, since it appears my old one got damaged in the flood. I've been running it since day 1 but there's no water in the bucket, so it's turning on but not doing anything. The minute I get a new one, the cases will go back in the basement with it and I'll run it max for a few days. I'm not smelling mildew yet, so hopefully there's still time. The soft cases got it worse, obviously, ans I tried drying them in the dryer, but it didn't work. Unlike the hard cases, they don't open up all the way, so I'm going to have to prop them open somehow when I get them back inside.

I did open up the few pedals and floor board controller that got soaked and sprayed them with compress air. They're airing out now. Amp appears to be alright as well, as the water didn't reach the speaker. The grill looks to be stained with a water line though. :(

What basically happened was the rubber boot connecting the PVC piping to the sump pump burst open, so I came home to the sump pump shooting water into the air like a geyser. We've been blasted with severe rain these few days and the pressure was too great. I managed to stabilize it/tighten it, and amazingly the sump pump drained out not only any water in the well but in the entire basement as well. (There's a french drain surrounding the pump as well). One little pump draining a 25' x 20' room submerged in 4-6" of water. With the exception of a few little areas with small puddles, the basement dried out completely. Amazing.

The biggest damage came to any paper materials I had on the floor - books, CDs/DVDs, posters, etc. I've been going through that stuff now to see what's salvageable. Wish me luck. This probably was an accident waiting to happen, though I've nver had a flood down there in 8 years of owning the house. All of this obviously will get me rethinking how and where I plan on storing my stuff down the line, as this was my greatest fear in keeping them down there. I thought about the palette idea too, but I'm wondering what I can use other than wood to raise them up. Maybe one of those drummer risers they make out of metal?

I did an incredibly dumb thing when this happened :roll: , and this is why I dodged a few bullets. When I came home and saw/heard the water, I instinctively panicked and ran down into the water to get my basses, later realizing that I had various power strips submerged under the water. Smoke was spewing from one of the power strip's outlets and the cable was melting. Puts things into perspective. As much as this was a disaster for me, in hindsight it could have been much worse and I might not be here right now. No possession is as valuable as my life, so in that respect I was lucky.

Thanks everyone. If you have any more suggestions regarding the preservation of my stuff, I'm all ears.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 15th, 2010, 9:31 am 
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Joined: March 14th, 2008, 1:45 pm
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Location: Huntsville, AL
Jeez man, didn't think about the electricity issue. Glad you're ok and glad your basses survived too 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 15th, 2010, 9:45 am 
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Joined: March 4th, 2008, 3:51 pm
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Peter, I posted your message from here on the BABP board too, you might want to check it for helpful responses too.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 15th, 2010, 12:42 pm 
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Glad you're OK, you're right-on that life and limb are infinitely more valuable than those ole hunks a' wood you have in your basement.

However you're post about the smoking power strip raises some real concerns for me. AFAIC if you had submerged powered gear and/or outlets, your breaker(s) should have tripped immediately. Even if they weren't submerged, exposure to water should have tripped the breaker(s). What I can infer from your post is that your basement is not properly/safely wired. As if you don't have enough to think about already! Jeez ....


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 15th, 2010, 12:49 pm 
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Joined: March 9th, 2008, 7:46 am
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Location: West Orange, NJ
Marc, I also thought that the circuit would have gone off if there were a short too (given that my house is notorious for blowing fuses and I'm constantly having to throw the circuit breaker, especially in the summer). The power strip on the floor is also a surge protector. Do you think that might have prevented the fuse from blowing? It's also possible the water had just started flowing over the top of the strip when I got there, as it wasn't completely submerged yet. The minute I saw it smoking, I ran over to it and switched it off. I did feel a slight current/shock when I touched the switch (Another incredibly dumb move).


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 15th, 2010, 2:10 pm 
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there's a lot to think about here.

Do you have glass screw in fuses? If so, run, do not walk and get a panel with modern breakers (a good use of the insurance money should you get some) and a licensed bonded insured IBEW union electrician to do the upgrade (can you tell I work for a utility? LOL).

Any contact with water and a powered indoor electrical device should immediatly trip a breaker. GFI (GFCI's) should trip even faster. Power strips and/or surge protectors are great at stopping current from rushing into your device, but i don't know how well built those lil buggars are at protecting surges from the device to the outlet (probably not). However, if there was water in the device AND you got a shock, that means current was flowing, which means the short stayed alive, which means that there was something in the circuit (from the electrical panel to the device) not properly grounded i.e causing the breaker to trip. It could be that particular circuit has no ground to it at all, in which case you're risking life and limb anytime you plug a device into that circuit. Or what you believe is the ground is actually a ground loop which might save your a$$ from getting cooked. just barely. Maybe. Depends on how it's wired and what it's wired to.

Bottom line is I would take this opportunity to rip out your basement wall panels and find out exactly what's going on in there 'cause something don't smell quite right to me and I'd hate to have to be buying your Jazz basses at an estate sale.

Sorry to sound so alarmist, but I've worked around electricity most of my adult life and don't really want to have to show you guys pictures of what happens to you when idiots try to cut down power lines when they want to steal the copper. Electricity is dangerous and indiscriminate.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 16th, 2010, 10:16 am 
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Peter, here is the response Kevin posted on the BABP board to my inquiry for you:

"Andrew - The pedals and the strips are a total loss. Even if you plugged them in and they work, in 2 weeks they could develop a short and kill you. As a shop we advise totaling the equipment. If your speakers didn't soak up to the voice coil, you MAY be ok after the paper dries but expect the tolex to come up. Just glue it back down and hopefully the cabs will be ok. The basses - If water did not reach any cavities your prob ok provided the water didn't reach any chips or finish checks. If you ever see a bass where the bottom finish peeled, its from water. If the water went over the bridge, remove the bridge and let it dry. Water under the bridge (no pun intended) could be a havoc reaker. The cases, leave em out side to dry. Your liner may get cruddy, your foam may get cruddy or hard. The tolex will prob bubble. Put a pin hole in the bubble and re-glue.. HOPEFULLY other than the electronics you'll be ok. Call me at the shop if ya need a hand. Kevin."

I linked Kevin's shop earlier, if you want to talk to him.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 24th, 2010, 10:46 pm 
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Joined: March 9th, 2008, 7:46 am
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Location: West Orange, NJ
Well just an update, as I'm finally finding time to get back to normal conversation again.

We got lucky around these parts last week and had unusually good weather, sunny and 65-73F (18-22c) every day, so I was able to air out the cases every day for most of the week in the backyard. Neighbors thought I was having some sort of garage sale, and now my wife officially knows how many instruments I have. :roll: The most damage done was probably my own doing to the cases, as it was windy and they kept toppling over like dominoes, so they got scuffed up and a few straps that connect each side of the cases to prevent them from opening fully ripped. :x I was afraid to lay them down so I kept them standing upright, since I wanted to keep the moisture concentrated in the lowest area and was afraid to have it drip further up the cases. In hindsight, I probably should have laid them down. Overall, a few seem fine, some do have a hard cruddy feel to them now, and some are amazingly still damp even after over a week of outdoor drying and dehumidifying. Oddly enough, the ones still wet are all older Fender cases.

As for the basses, they appear to be okay, (though I did take a nice chip out of finish of my Phantom Teardrop's headstock in transit). and they've been drying out out in a heat controlled room. I don't plan on powering anything up yet for a couple more weeks anyway, since the basement's still a wreck and I don't have anywhere to go with everything, and I'm still assessing overall damages for insurance purposes.

Thanks to everyone for your help and input.


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 25th, 2010, 9:11 am 
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Good to hear from you PJ, I was wondering how you were doing. Really glad to hear your instruments weren't damaged- hopefully your other gear is at least semi-replaceable and will be covered by your insurance. Too bad about having to expose your wife to the horrible truth-- but now that she knows everything, you'll be able to start adding a few more, right? :P ...

Is your basement "finished" or "unfinished" ? Are looking at having to to tear up flooring, walls, etc?


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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 25th, 2010, 10:24 am 
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Glad to hear that you are getting things sorted out. Hang in there PJ, best of luck to you.

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 Post subject: Re: Emergency! Flood! Help!
PostPosted: March 25th, 2010, 11:33 am 
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Hope your losses are a minimal from this Peter. Keep well.


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